How is pyrope different from Almandine?

Moderator
Registration: 03.01.2005
From: Perm Posts: 2912
Friend: 3
Votes: 151 / 24 Added: 12.10.2011/18/34 25:XNUMX:XNUMX On the question of Czech grenades that are no longer available:
Shop with Czech garnets in Moscow
http://www.granat-shop.ru/
in the Czech Republic
http://www.granat.eu/ru/index.php?p=110
“The company “Granát, duv Turnov” is the exclusive owner of unique mines of Czech garnet”
Otherwise, pyrope and almandine and much more from the list are all garnets. where is the deception then??
If you are looking for pyrope in products, then look for it, you found the inscription Pyrope on the label, went to the expert and checked, it is not pyrope. sellers for a knife
But what can we say about synthetics – it should be written on the labels that it is synthetics. Moderator
Registration: 03.01.2005
From: Perm Posts: 2912
Friend: 3
Votes: 151 / 24 Added: 12.10.2011/18/37 53:XNUMX:XNUMX all synthetic analogues similar in composition are still grenades with the prefix
everything else is glass, cubic zirconia with a similar color, etc. – imitation. User
Registration: 29.10.2010
From: Montreal, Canada Posts: 786
Friend: 7
Votes: 280 / 4 Added: 12.10.2011/18/56 08:XNUMX:XNUMX In my message, which is partially quoted (that there are no such garnets left), it is said that now there are companies (shops at jewelry shops) that sell real Czech chrome-pyropes and products with them, having an exclusive license from some then there are “competent authorities” in the Czech Republic. The links provided are, apparently, to the stores of one of these companies.. In addition, “no more” means not that the garnets themselves no longer exist, but that commercial mining has almost completely ceased due to the exhaustion of the source. There are still reserves of mined raw materials in the Czech Republic, although in general the quality of the material is not the best, which is noticeable in the photographs of their products.. Historically known Czech pyropes were very bright and significantly lighter than modern material.. Although raw materials of exclusive quality in the Czech Republic also remained in some small quantities. Refractive indices for glass are 1.520-1.550, for GGG and YGG garnets – 1.970+
That is, with a standard refractometer, glass is easily distinguished from garnet by its low refractive index value, and synthetic garnets by a value that is beyond the upper limit of the scale of a standard refractometer, in other words, the refractometer will go off scale for them. Garnets that are chemically and structurally identical to natural ones are still unknown, with one exception. At least there is no confirmed data on their existence. The exception is the new synthetic tsavorites, but they were released onto the market only once in relatively small quantities, and since then (at least 2 years) nothing has been heard about them. Sincerely,
GSK User
Registration: 20.01.2010
From: russia Posts: 324
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Votes: 8 / 0 Added: 12.10.2011/19/27 25:XNUMX:XNUMX GSK, Although, on the other hand, the manufacturer is not deceiving anyone – the label says – pomegranate.. And which one is not written.. It turns out that, out of ignorance, the sellers verbally claim that it is natural.. without a signature User
Registration: 29.10.2010
From: Montreal, Canada Posts: 786
Friend: 7
Votes: 280 / 4 Added: 12.10.2011/19/33 04:XNUMX:XNUMX It seems to me that it is not always worth categorically asserting that there is some kind of deception. The biggest problem in this area is the incompetence of sellers.. Personal, so to speak, incompetence of specific individuals.. Believe me, this unfortunate fact is not exclusive to Russia; similar incompetence can be found throughout the globe. Jewelry and stones are sold everywhere in one way or another by many people who do not have knowledge in this area.. Sellers are just hired workers.. Yesterday they were selling panties or bread, and today – electronics or grenades.. Sincerely,
GSK User
Registration: 29.10.2010
From: St. Petersburg Posts: 113
Friend: 1
Votes: 2 / 0 Added: 13.10.2011/12/46 03:XNUMX:XNUMX GSK,
In addition to Cowards and Grenades. We all know that Czech garnets are a brand.
which has been familiar for a very long time – the stones are mostly small, sprinkling, etc.
And an attempt to sell something larger than 4-5mm in a store and pass it off as the Czech Republic –
simple – a marketing and store move. knowledgeable people, if they correct me, there are VERY few large pomegranates in the Czech Republic.
and all that’s cool is Tanzania, Madagascar, or some other Africa For a gemological certificate GSK, THANKS. Modified: Gem Set – 13.10.2011/12/47 28:XNUMX:XNUMX User
Registration: 20.01.2010
From: russia Posts: 324
Friend: 0
Votes: 8 / 0 Added: 03.12.2011/00/32 54:XNUMX:XNUMX GSK, By the way, here’s a riddle for children!
As far as I know, diamonds in Yakutia were found by geologist Popugaeva using pyropes, since
they are indispensable companions of diamonds.. The question is – where are they? Why don’t we have many, many of them? without a signature User
Registration: 29.10.2010
From: Montreal, Canada Posts: 786
Friend: 7
Votes: 280 / 4 Added: 03.12.2011/00/37 04:XNUMX:XNUMX You know that right. This is exactly how diamonds were found, and not only in Yakutia. There are quite a few manifestations of pyrope around the world.. But it doesn’t want to be used as jewelry anywhere.. It’s always very dark, brown and opaque.. Sincerely,
GSK User
Registration: 20.01.2010
From: russia Posts: 324
Friend: 0
Votes: 8 / 0 Added: 03.12.2011/00/44 27:XNUMX:XNUMX
GSK, So how to distinguish pyrope from almandine? I have a garnet of 3 carats – what if it’s pyrope?
without a signature Moderator
Registration: 03.01.2005
From: Perm Posts: 2912
Friend: 3
Votes: 151 / 24 Added: 03.12.2011/00/48 35:XNUMX:XNUMX not at all.
I had the opportunity to cut pyropes, just the same ones from Yakutia, the color is very pleasant – deep, bright, there is another problem – the dimensions, it didn’t work out more than 2 mm, that’s why they don’t exist)))) User
Registration: 29.10.2010
From: Montreal, Canada Posts: 786
Friend: 7
Votes: 280 / 4 Added: 03.12.2011/00/48 47:XNUMX:XNUMX Do a chemical analysis and distinguish with a guarantee.. Take a refractometer – a good chance to get the right answer.. And if the stone is clean and transparent, then there is nothing to distinguish.. The probability of such a 3-carat jewelry pyrope is comparable to the probability of finding a pure transparent three-carat diamond in the ground in front of the door of your house.. Sincerely,
GSK User
Registration: 29.10.2010
From: Montreal, Canada Posts: 786
Friend: 7
Votes: 280 / 4 Added: 03.12.2011/00/52 30:XNUMX:XNUMX Sun, That’s what I meant. there are little small things that are not big-bellied and, at the very least, they are available.. But you can’t find a serious size anymore.. 3 carats for pyrope is like 10 for a diamond or 50 for a sapphire.. Sincerely,
GSK User
Registration: 29.10.2010
From: Montreal, Canada Posts: 786
Friend: 7
Votes: 280 / 4 Added: 03.12.2011/02/48 27:XNUMX:XNUMX In gemology, there is perhaps no other topic that causes so much controversy and is filled to the brim with disagreements as the classification of garnets. Only the mineralogical part does not raise doubts. 6 varieties of minerals – pyralspites (pyrope, almandine, spessartite) and ugrandites (uvarovite, grossular, andradite) form in various combinations (in isomorphic rows) all known types of precious stones – garnets. In total, there are 15 minerals in the garnet family, but we do not consider the remaining 9, since jewelry-grade material is not found among them. As already mentioned, garnet minerals are practically never found in nature in their pure form, but they are found in the form of isomorphic (mutually substituting) compositions. The classification of such compositions has been the subject of debate for many decades. Most precious garnets belong (according to Hanneman) to 5 isomorphic series: – Pirop-Almandin
– Pyrope-Spessartine
– Spessartine-Almandine
– Pyrope-Grossular
– Grossular-Andradite Even among the leading scientific and information centers (GIA, Gems-A, International Mineralogical Association) there is no agreement on which stone should be called, for example, pyrope, which should be called almandine, and which should be called pyrope-almandine. Leading independent gemologists also adhere to their own points of view. Mineralogists traditionally use the 50%-50% rule. That is, if a particular stone contains at least 51% pyrope (by homomic composition) and only 49% almandine, then a mineralogist will most likely call such a stone pyrope. They do not recognize “average” variants of isomorphic series. Either pyrope or almandine, but not pyrope-almandine. In gemology, such intermediate variants are recognized. Gemologists do not consider the optical and physical characteristics of the mineral varieties of garnets in their “pure” form. For different isomorphic series, such characteristics overlap, and garnet identification is carried out according to ranges. These ranges are tied to various, well-established names of pomegranates used in the world. The problem is that there are several options for such ranges; there is no single generally accepted solution to the issue. And what range, what system to use is a subjective decision, depending only on the preferences of a particular gemologist. When identifying garnets, the density of the stones is an important but secondary factor. The primary factors are color (visible to the eye and readable by spectral analysis) and refractive index. The table below demonstrates the differences in approaches to this issue on the part of 2 authoritative organizations (GIA and Gem-A) and Dr. Hanneman (a famous gemologist, a leading expert on garnets): Refractive indices of precious garnets
Hanneman Gems-A GIA
Pyrope 1.714 – * 1.74-1.76 1.720-1.770
Almandine *-1.830 1.76-1.81 1.760-1.820
Spessartine *-1.800-* 1.79-1.82 1.790-1.814
Grossular *-1.734-* 1.73-1.75 1.730-1.760
Andradite *-1.887 1.87-1.90 1.855-1.895
* – depending on the isomorphic series At the GIA, in-depth research on garnets was conducted by Carol M. Stockton and Dr. Vincent D. Manson in the 1980s, resulting in the final GIA classification document for gem garnets published in 1985. In this document, precious garnets were divided into 8 varieties, namely: grossular, andradite, pyrope, pyrope-almandine, almandine, almandine-spessartine, spessartine and pyrope-spessartine. The classification took into account refractive index, visible color, spectra and chemical composition. Refractive indices according to Stockton and Manson Min. variety of Coeff. refracted Color Name
Grossular 1.730-1.760 Green to reddish-orange, colorless Tsavorite, Mali, Hessonite
Andradite 1.880-1.895 Very faint yellowish-green to orangish-yellow Demantoid, Topazolite
Pyrope 1.714-1.742 Purpish-red to reddish-orange, colorless Pyrope, Chrome pyrope
Pyrope-Almandine 1.742-1.785 Reddish-orange to red-purple Rhodolite
Almandine 1.785-1.830 Orange-red to purplish-red Almandine-Spessartine 1.810-1.820 Reddish-orange to orange-red
Spessartine 1.780-1.810 Yellowish orange to reddish orange
Pyrope-Spessartine 1.742-1.780 Greenish-yellow to purple, blue-green, green-blue Malaya, Color changing During the research process, Stockton and Manson published 4 “interim” articles in Gems & Gemology, which attracted the attention of Dr. Hanneman. The latter proposed his own system of classification of garnets, which seems more convenient for gemologists to understand and use in practice. But I would like to emphasize once again that each gemologist makes his own choice about which system to use. Classification of garnets according to Hanneman isomorphic series Name Coefficient. refraction according to Hannemann Variety (trade names) Pyrope-Almandine Pyrope 1.714-1.749 Czech pyrope, Chrome pyrope
Pyrope-Almandine 1.749-1.795 Rhodolite
Almandine 1.795-1.830 Almandine garnet
______________________________________________________________ _________________________________________________
Pyrope-Spessartine Pyrope 1.714-1.740 Pyrope
Pyrope-Spessartine 1.740-1.774 Malaya Garnet,
Garnet with color changing effect
Spessartine 1.774-1.800 Spessartine
____________________________________________________________ _____________________________________________________
Almandine-Spessartine Spessartine 1.800-1.809 Spessartine
Almandine-Spessartine 1.809-1.821 Mandarin, Cashmere, Hollandin
Almandine 1.821-1.830 Almandine garnet
____________________________________________________________ _____________________________________________________
Grossular-Almandine Grossular 1.734-1.763 Grossular (Grossularite)
Grossular-Almandine 1.763-1.801 Hydrogrossular
Almandine 1.821-1.830 Garnet-Almandine
____________________________________________________________ _____________________________________________________
Grossular-Spessartine Grossular 1.734-1.754 Tsavorite, Hessonite
Grossular-Spessartine 1.754-1.780 Hydrogrossular, Hessonite
Spessartine 1.780-1.800 Spessartine
____________________________________________________________ _____________________________________________________
Pyrope-Grossular Pyrope 1.714-1.720 Pyrope
Pyrope-Grossular 1.720-1.728 Grossular (Grossularite)
Grossular 1.728-1.734 Grossular (Grossularite)
____________________________________________________________ _____________________________________________________
Grossular-Andradite Grossular 1.734-1.770 Garnet Mali
Grossular-Andradite 1.770-1.841 Grandite
Andradite 1.841-1.887 Melanite, Topazolite, Demantoid
____________________________________________________________ _____________________________________________________ Illustrations to help understand Hanneman’s concept:
The illustrations show the “variability” of characteristics in 2 specific isomorphic series. Unfortunately (in my opinion), there are no prerequisites yet that leading gemological organizations will accept the Hannemann system; in fact, they have already rejected it. But everything said here shows how difficult the issue of classifying garnets remains to this day. Pomegranate is one of the most common groups on planet Earth. Contrary to popular belief, this is not a separate stone, it is a whole group of minerals that differ not only in composition, luster, density, but also in color. What used to be called simply garnet is actually pyrope or almandine. These stones are varieties of the garnet group, which are very similar to each other. Both have red hues, perfect brilliance and high hardness. However, these are completely different gems, which are very different in the world of mineralogy. We will explain the main properties of these stones so that you know how to distinguish them.

What is the difference between pyrope and almandine garnets

First of all, it should be said that the stones differ slightly in their shades. If pyrope is blood-red, orange-red, purple, pink, dark red, then almandine has deeper colors, saturated, almost black: cherry, raspberry, purple, brown-red. The next difference is belonging to a precious group. Both minerals belong to it, but only if they have perfect, exceptional transparency. In addition, with equal characteristics, almandine is considered a more expensive gem. Minerals also have differences in physical properties:

Characterization	Almandine	pyrope
Brilliance	glassy, ​​sometimes resinous	exclusively glass
Line color	transparent	white
Cleavage	imperfect	no
Kink	uneven or conchoidal	only uneven
Density	4,3 g / cm³	3,65 – 3,84 g / cm³

As you can see, these minerals are completely different in structure, although outwardly they are very similar. Also noteworthy is the fact that pyrope is very often found next to diamond – the most expensive stone known to mankind. It is also mined in kimberlite pipes. But almandine is more often formed in highly flattened shales rich in sillimanite and biotite. Now you know what is the difference between pyrope and almandine and you will be able to distinguish these minerals on your own.